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Post by ophion1031 on Oct 21, 2019 22:31:05 GMT -8
traveller1st posted this at Morph's site but it is only the FBI document - no letter and/or cipher. For what it's worth, there was a man in prison for armed robbery in San Jose who supposedly offered to testify against Arthur Leigh Allen, claiming he had information that Allen was Zodiac. Nothing must have ever came of that since Allen was never arrested or charged.
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Post by amazingates on Nov 7, 2019 19:35:56 GMT -8
On page 2 of this report (which is the firsst page shown on this thread) Anything in parenthesis is MY note I made and not part of the FBI report
Enclosed herewith for the FBI Laboratory are two copies of the letter received by _____REDACTED______________ San Jose PD, San Jose, Calif. on this date (my note 11/21/69 is the date of the report)
As noted the message reads
REDACTED
The Laboratory is requested to have the Cryptogram Section attemp to immediately decipher the message and furnish the result to the San Francisco Office.
For the information of the Bureau and Sacramento, after a cursory ananlysis, officers of the San Jose, Calif. PD believe widow in message may be Mrs >>>>REACTED<<<< San Jose, Calif. San Jose Pd instituting 24 hour surveilance on Mrs ____REDACTED____.
Second page of report on this thread
11/24/69 Copy of handprinted note beginning "There's no doubt I will do my Thing!" and with the symbol 0 (<<<--- that is my attemept to type the Z symbol)
Resut of examination:
The ciphertext portion of the Qc33 is not readable using previously recovered key. Its brevity precludes further cryptanalytic examination at this time.
The furnished interpretation of "**62+-" as representing "1620" can be neither proved or disproved analytically. The "=" between "November" and "8" cound represent the number "2" (my note?). Such interpretation would be based on inferences drawn from the date of the postmark, not form cryptanalytic examination.
One copy of Qc33 is returned herewith. The second copy is being retained by Bureau.
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Post by amazingates on Nov 7, 2019 20:17:56 GMT -8
So the san jose pd gets a letter from Z
there is something in there about a WIDOW MRS ___________, so the SJ PD put a 24 hour surveilence on MRS _________
so this all has to do with something about a WIDOW in San Jose.
_________________
What we know the Zodiac wrote in this message
something about the widow above
There is Ciphertext in the message FBI says they can't figure it out with previous recovered KEY, WHAT KEY is that?
Beginning -"There is no doubt I will do my Thing!" with the zodiac symbol(most likely at the end because the fbi always lists the beginning words and the end words.
"**62+-" FBI interprets as 6620 "November" "unknown something ?" "8" FBI interprets the unknown something sign as a 2 ( they say they base this on the postmark of the message, not by analytical interpretation)
The FBI is not sure of either of the interpretations. They say they can't be sure of anything and previous code key won't work on this.
_____________________________
SO what postmark are they using to decide the "unknown number?" sign is a 2? If they are thinking it is a 2, then the message must have been mailed right before november 28... and there is no year? or was there and they just did not say? .
why are they getting 6620 out of "**66+-" ? that does not make sense either. especially if they have no key to work with.
and how do they get 6220 out of "**62+-" ? what are they doing with the ** spaces in there?
and what previously code KEY are they talking about.
and who is this widow who they think needs surveilence? ___________________________
see there is so much the FBI has that we don't. this is why we can't figure anything out for sure. We need that previous code KEY... and it was RECOVERED? recovered from where and when? was it lost somewhere? for how long? do they even understand it? haha . I don't know if that supposed unknown number the say is a two looked like what they have on their paper but that looks like a "=" to me. but it would have to depend on they added in the actual mark on this fbi report or is that just how THE FBI typed it on the report?
so this letter etc goes to the lab in november 11 1969. so what is the postmark on it? it can't be november 28 1969 so that is after the fbi gets it, so it would have to be november 28 1968? has to be November(somewhere around the 28th based on what FBI is saying in the report) IF THEY ARE RIGHT BUT THEY SAY THEY DO NOT KNOW,SO THEY ARE GUESSING. so we can't believe that for sure. and they have this report in November of 1969, so why would it be november 28 unless the year of the message is 1968... but then why the surveilence on the WIDOW if the letter was dated a year before the FBI is looking at it? so in this scenario none of this date stuff is making sense. Or am I totally confused here?
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Post by amazingates on Nov 7, 2019 20:29:47 GMT -8
so when did this Mrs ________ become a widow? was it 1968 and this is an anniversary letter threatening her? in 1969? none of this is making sense
was her husband murdered? and now she is threatened?
who the heck was killed in November in San Jose, either in 1968 or 1969?
if the date on the report is 11/21 1969, then there is no way the letter was received in 1969 on the 28th... the 28th of 1969 AFTER they had the letter at the fbi, so this has to be 1968 or before that the letter was postmarked... but why is there surveilence on the widow a year later. it has to be a threat on some anniversary of the widow's husband dying, most likely being murdered?
I vaguely remember some weird murder in san jose that Spf and I were looking at a LONG time ago, let me ask him if he remembers what it was etc. I think we were wondering if it were the Z why I don't know. gee this has been so long ago.
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Post by amazingates on Nov 7, 2019 20:57:38 GMT -8
ok on the FBI report under Armed and Dangerous are there are notes or enclosures sent to different places... on being sacramento. it reads
2-Sacramento (9-68)... that seems like the date of september 1968.... if this is true then the murder of the widow's husband might have happened in sept 68? or a letter about the same event was mailed to them in sept 68? this is a GUESS on the meaning of 9-68 beging sept 68... but makes sense. why did they send 2 copies to sacramento in sept 68? is that just where the fed office was?
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Post by amazingates on Nov 7, 2019 21:10:22 GMT -8
what is the
Re Butte tel to Bureau, 11/21/69?
is that talking about Butte County, CA?
I'm pretty familiar with Butte County, CA area. what would that have to do with some Widow in San Jose?
was there a murder up there? in 1968? did the widow use to live in Butte County? did Butte County get a call from Zodiac, or a letter as well? did someone call from Butte County who knew about the widow being threatened or something?
none of this is making sense. I hate it when we don't have all the information. If we ever had the info we could probably help figure out this dang case.
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Post by amazingates on Nov 9, 2019 0:25:47 GMT -8
this is the part that really interests me "**62+-" I wish we could see the contents so we can see what this number was all about
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